It doesn't mean you're right it doesn't Mean you're wrong but you have to have a Take everybody can do social media kind Of thing the main goal of social media Is posting posts don't be a douche maybe That should be the name of this episode [Music] Hey Anna hey everyone Hi everybody and welcome back to the Next episode of operation Automation and Today we're joined by Daryl the CMO of Agora Pals which I'm sure you've heard Of before but before we're going to talk About Daryl and social media and Agora Pulse and that kind of stuff we're going To talk about ourselves because that is The main point of today's episode as You'll find out yep and for me this Episode is something special because I'm Not a social media kind of person myself So you know mainly I use YouTube for Entertainment and Linkedin for career or Professional purposes so I've got one Question and this time it's not only a Question to you Anna but it's actually Question to everyone who is listening to This episode like guys how do you use Your LinkedIn profile since I'm the only One who can answer you right now I'm Gonna jump in but guys if you do want to Let us know we are really interested in It so please reach out to us in the Comments through our social channels Which are linked in the show notes
Through the email which is podcast Getresponse.com Or you can send us voice messages Straight from anchor we are really eager To hear what you have to say about it Now back to us so how do I use LinkedIn I gotta say I'm pretty selfish here Because for me LinkedIn generally comes Down to Anxious job search and just a quick Disclaimer I'm not thinking about Changing careers anytime soon instead When I get anxious and I'm a pretty anxious Person so a couple of times per day I Want to make sure that my career pass is Still there that what I do is still Valued and that the market really cares About the skills and experience that That I have to offer so I jump on LinkedIn I check for possible openings And I see the content marketing is still A big deal which is always nice and Heartwarming for me So I know it's probably not an ideal LinkedIn usage and I know that the Original intent behind the network was Probably something greater and I guess Iraq you are way better at this huge Element of LinkedIn Social networking which is Haha Networking yeah I mean I'm I'm trying I'm doing my best Um but I think that it's perfectly fine
If you have your profile and you are a Bit selfish as you said you know meaning That you actually You know Try to get out of the platform As much as you can and you don't Actively contribute that much when it Comes to content perhaps that's totally Fine because you know even if you're Profile is relevant is up to date you Are still you know you could be easily Reached by people who struggle with Something they would like to connect With you meaningfully right they would Like to ask you or invite to participate In a project so this is still great I Think that you are contributing a lot And um yeah I found for example that LinkedIn is great Um before offline events so for example Next week Um I'm gonna run workshops on email Marketing in Warsaw but because I you Know have my LinkedIn Network I could Inform people about that tell them that I'm going to be in Warsaw and then Invite them to take part in the Workshops you know so this is cool Because now basically you know people Know that there is this opportunity uh If they have any questions they could Ask it right away so they could help me Prepare so you know it is wonderful so Definitely networking and tribe as Dario
Puts it Is there and it's it's a huge part of it So This episode is great because That shows shares a lot of you know tips Or like how to make the most of it Yeah and I think that's just it that's Why both LinkedIn and offline events Such as workshops or conferences or Different kind of meetups work because You get to meet the specific people that You know are interested in what you have To offer and at the end of the day I'd Even say this is probably a single most Important thing you can do most for your Business And your personal brand you want to find Those people who You really connect with both on the Professional and the personal level Daryl and Eric called the tribe you Don't have to get into the terminology But if you want to take one single thing Out of this episode I would say Just be authentic allow yourself to be a Little bit selfish online allow yourself To share the thoughts you may not Necessarily have the right people to Agree with at the moment because You will find those who do agree with You those who support you And that's why social media is such a Big thing because it doesn't limit you To one geographical area or one specific
Group of people it allows you to be as Authentic as you can be And not just as a person but also as a Business because this is a business Marketing podcast Yep and speaking of business side of Social media that will also like explain How to turn social media into a revenue Channel and you said something about you Know finding people who agree with you This is great but also as we'll be Hearing in the episode it's not the goal So if you have like people who disagree With you it's even better it's better For the community it's better for Networking and it's better for your Um Social media engagement so let's jump Into the episode enjoy [Music] Hey there my name is Daryl Pearl I'm the Chief marketing officer at agorapults Agorapults is the industry's most Notable remarkable amazing social media Mansion platform myself I'm a social Media guy I'm a revenue guy I'm a Marketer I've been hired I've been fired I've been raised a lot of money and if You follow me on Twitter then you'll Know I'm opinionated and that my friends Is who I am That is the best introduction we've had I love it and before we move into the Very important part of talking about
Social media business Revenue growth all That stuff We have the most important question of Them all and that is what is the one Thing in life you wish you could Automate Oh Oh oh there's so many options with this Uh but I have an answer I have an answer The one thing in life I wish I could Automate is my the preparation of my Dinner my daily you know meal supper Dinner call what you will so that when I'm done at the office I walk outside And it's just sitting there waiting and It's done it's automated you know you Maybe you have these hoppers for all These different raw ingredients and it Just does its magical thing like on The Jetsons and then boom there's a meal That's what I want I want to automate That make that happen you'll have my Money I love it yeah that's great although I Actually enjoy cooking so if that was Automating like shopping that's fine With me but actually when it comes to Cooking I pretty much enjoy it I can't stand cooking because I when I Work all day the last thing I want to do Is go be frustrated and stressed out by By timing different dishes at different Times and different temperatures it's Just it's I just do not find it relaxing
So but I get so many people do I totally Get it I mean I have moods I have it Really depends one day I can like a week I can eat a pizza for a week and I'll be Very happy with it because I don't have To move a finger see my we you know what We we compromise kind of what you just Said we move a finger it's usually on The phone pad to order the food to show Up at our house that's how it works for Us Oh that's cool foreign [Music] I wanted to ask you about the role of Social media and business in general Like you know what is your perspective On that How much time you got brother this is The social medias we get time we do we Do we have all the time in the world all Right so I'm gonna ramble feel free to Cut me off in a rugby challenge me Disagree with me please I love when People do that let me set the stage all Right so I was at a company for almost Five years as the chief Revenue officer I had a good gig I was well paid I was Respected you know I had a great team And I left after almost five years to go Where to intentionally go to a social Media management company why Because in my observation doing my job And again I have a sales and a marketing Background I have leadership roles in
Both the one commonality that I do not See changing in for years and years to Come is the prolific use of social media Both in developing new business as well As developing a personal brand as well As developing a corporate brand as well As engaging with your tribe so just Think about what you do all day long Right you're in community you're with Customers you're you're prospecting You're you're connecting It's all social So if the question is you know what's The main goal of social media and Business it's what I just said all right So first and foremost the business Person in me would say the main goal of Social media business is to drive Revenue Full stop okay driving Revenue though Can be done multiple ways it can be done By developing and finding and developing New customers As well as supporting existing customers Which will result in either an expansion Of the money they're spending with you Or it will result in reduction of churn Because they're loyal to you and are Willing to overlook some shortcomings in Your offering because of that loyalty so Number one the role and the goal of Social media in business is to drive Revenue full stop A second roll though equally important
Is the role of awareness and thought Leadership and influence because when You look at what if you're looking for Funding a lot of your funding is not Just based on the revenues you're Currently earning but it's based on the Hype the value around your personal Brand if you're looking to go public Similarly a big influence is on the Value of your personal brand you know I Could buy Apple stock or I could buy HP Stock they both make computers whose Brand is bigger apple and they get a Higher multiple because of it right so That's the secondary role in the first Roll that's my long-winded answer agree Disagree Bring It On Let's Go no I mean I absolutely love it not much to Disagree with I also love it how you Connect these First-time customers or clients or Visitors with existing groups and how You can use it for both awareness and Retention in a way yeah And one of the things we didn't talk About so there is a third bullet there And then I'm sorry I'll go I'll go back To you is and get and because you Mentioned Anna is the Social media can be used to attract new Talent we're in a talent shortage right So we you know as and prospective Employees we often have more than one Offer on the table and we get to choose
Who we want to work for quite often so Why would I work for your company versus The other company well it's because I Perceive that you're a more engaged Involved uh connected company to the Space uh I care about and I where did I Get that from I got it from your Presence on social media typically or The discussions taking place about you On social media so there we go shut up That's my three I made it to it was Three but I'm really done This is amazing I wanted to go back to The first one because it it sounds great I love it when you said that the role or The main goal of social media is to Drive Revenue this is amazing but On the other hand when I when I look at You know some Profiles uh especially like business Profiles I would say that from what I'm Seeing it's like as if the main goal of Social media is posting posts it's yes It's it's basically just you know you You try to post something that some People might find relevant but it's very Chaotic usually uh I can't figure out Like a proper strategy behind it so my Question is uh what are the challenges So that you know people that they don't Find it that easy actually to turn Social media into a Let's say Revenue Channel but say treat It as this sort of place where we need
To post something because it's already Six o'clock and we haven't posted Anything yet Sorry I'm just laughing because it's so True and what are the challenges so you Just asked a small question okay that's Just a quick dirty question okay what's The challenge just all right again in no Particular order what are the challenges The challenges are that most leaders the Leaders who control the budgets would it Be for a social media staff or social Media tools Um literally do not understand social Media that's number one They just don't right they're equating Their own personal use of posting on Facebook or Instagram as being how it's Done in business and as we both know There's a World's apart Um number two The people who do understand social Media are often younger and they don't Understand here's the irony they don't Understand business they can't read a Balance sheet they're not yet Accountable for driving revenues they're Accountable for doing their task for Example imagine somebody who's a Copywriter you know they write great Blogs what have you they're not Accountable for the revenues hitting Sales targets but they understand social Because it gets their content out there
Um so because they don't understand the Revenue side the finance side they can't Educate the people who understand the Finance side but don't understand social Media so both sides are to blame here That's it's a sandwich right Um bookends call up if you will so That's the first two things the next Thing is A lot of and I I hammer this on on my Social media feeds knocks up so many Heads of marketing VPS are marketing uh Heads of marketing CMOS Treat social media like a necessary Evo Your point it's six o'clock we haven't Posted anything just go do something get It out there right so when I go into my Weekly review meeting with my CEO or With the leadership team they can I Won't get a hammered because they'll see Something on the timeline and they'll Say okay cool there's something out There we're not ignoring it but the Reality is The reality is they do not treat social Media as a measurable Channel like they Do for other channels like pay-per-click Or trade shows I can measure Pay-per-click I can actually measure it I can say I spent fifty thousand dollars This month and I drove uh a quarter Million of lifetime value I can totally Measure that Um I can't do that
Well easily in social media without it Being a lot of work and that's the last Part why not because people are lazy Because right now it's a lot of work to Truly measure the impact of social media You need to make every single link and Not everything can be linked for example On Instagram I can't post a link I can In the comments but not in the post so I Need to make sure where I can post a Link that is trackable make it trackable I have to create the UTM codes and then I can track it maybe Google analytics or Somewhere else that's a lot of work It's amazing how many marketers can't Even spell UTM let alone understand it But if you don't understand UTM codes You're never going to track it so Ignorance at the top ignorance at the Bottom and laziness so those are your Reasons why they're not treating it like A channel and until enough people Do a couple things either make it really Easy to create those trackable links and I say that full disclosure we have just Done that at Agora pulse you can check It out it's it's a game changer I'm not Saying that to Advocate there's a reason We did that we did that because it Needed to take place so we can measure The ROI Um so you have to either make it really Simple the second part is is you need a Lot of success stories where they're
Saying oh my God I just went through the Economy it sucked I laid off half my Staff I reduced my pay-per-click channel But you know where I survived I survived Because I increased the revenue driven By social media by 300 and when people See enough of those stories there will Be adoption so right now it's early days We are nowhere near Main Street we are At early adoption stage so you're going To look for people who are there for if You're a marketer right there right now This is a brilliant time for you to go And Define your career by using social Media to drive Revenue Um and then the last there is one Annoying excuse you'll hear which is Nothing that I just told you the excuse You'll hear is It's just a lot of noise it's really Hard to be heard that's what you're Gonna get it's a lot of noise all right Those are my answers what did I miss did I get it right did it wrong hit me come On challenge let's go I have so much to Impact here I have so many questions so I'm going to start with the most basic One because it's something that Iraq and I as content marketers we talk about a Lot between ourselves so there is this General approach to content writing that Everybody writes For example I'm a Content writer I don't Do social media very consciously because
I know that I'm not good at it and a Person who should be doing it should be A social media expert or social media Manager Etc How do you feel about the everybody can Do social media kind of thing where HRS Are doing it for companies or office Managers are taking care of it you know That kind of stuff Well that's the classic in the job Description the one paragraph that Always says and anything else we didn't Think of you know that you do ABC Anything else we didn't think of which Is like oh shoot we need to do social Media and the classic line is they look Around and they say okay who's young in The office and would probably like this Oh look HR has a lot of young you know HR interns or just you know fresh out of School uh same for copywriting Um and they'll say that person that Person can do it or they maybe have a Bubbly personality and they assume Because they have a great personality in The office that they would be great Online right it's and again what does That go to the point I was making Earlier which is Senior Management Doesn't understand social media as a Channel as a tactic as a strategy and Therefore they're just making stupid Assumptions they're young they must Understand social media give it to them
And of course what are you going to say The answer is no I don't want it no They're not going to say that because They're they just they just got the job They want to keep the job they're going To say okay it's a leadership issue so Go ahead no I was just thinking so many Examples are running through my head When I worked at a company it had a Really great social media expert person And he was also a content creator like Content director that kind of stuff so He was doing videos he was an artistic Photographer If you go to the company's Instagram you Can spot the moment when he was fired And another person to cover because it Was the year was 2020 and Instagram Collages came back And that's the thing right so that's the Beauty of bringing in somebody who's got The raw skills right so in your example That individual was passionate about Photography and everything else so they Brought their passion with them into Social media what you're seeing there is The power of social media the Power of Social media is to reflect the Personality to perfect the person so That person could have been posting on Behalf of the company but they were Injecting their passion for photography So therefore the company benefited Because they were like wow we like this
Company and this person who's stopping Their their content because it's fun It's different it's engaging it's funny When I started doing social media and I Want to say when I started doing meaning When I actually took it seriously I'm as Guilty as the leaders I'm giving grief To there was a time when to me like for Example LinkedIn was just a place for Your resume for a recruiter to find me And if I updated it once a year with the Latest accomplishment or what have you a New salary title that was it that's all I did that's what I do that's so there You go and in the total funny story I Had a significant uh friend of the Family come to me the other day to that Point then I'll get back on task Um where they said hey I'm not happy in My job I want to look around but I know I don't know where to look you know and I'm like okay well we gotta update your Resume so we updated the resume no Problem and then they said okay what now I said now we need to update your LinkedIn and they're like what do you Mean I'm like Dude You can go looking for jobs but I said The good jobs are going to find you and They're going to find you online does Let's go overhaul your LinkedIn so be Like okay and we spent an hour we Updated the LinkedIn instantly overnight
They had recruiters calling them Non-stop That's The Power of social Media to get found so and they were Blown away by that so I'm glad you Updated regularly that's a very smart Move for your career Where I finally realize social media was Impactful was when I was Forced to which is what's going to Happen to a lot of people I was Competing against two other vendors who Had raised hundreds of millions of Dollars and were outspending me and There was no way I was going to compete On pay-per-click or trade show Sponsorship all the usual technique so The only way I could beat them without Spending a fortune was on social media That that's the first part I treated it As a channel because it was helping me Hit my goals and that meant I would hit My bonus my variable compensation so That was the first part second part Though was to your point about your your The individual I went to my CEO and I Said people don't buy from faceless Nameless companies People buy from people so for us to do This right Somebody in our company needs to become That spokesperson that evangelist that Personality And unless I'm mistaken I don't see Anybody volunteering so let me put my
Hand up and I'll do it because I was a CMO I guess it's got to be me it was Interesting to see his reaction his Reaction and it was not uncommon his Reaction was like wait a minute we Already pay you a large sum of money and Now you want us to invest more in your Own personal brand And I I knew where he was going I said Let me guess your fear is you're gonna You're gonna invest in my personal brand And then I'll get poached I'll get Stolen and all your money is gone And he said yes I said don't worry about that right Don't worry about that all right you Know I'm happy I'm here for a reason I'm Coming to you with a suggestion for a Reason so that we're successful and if That starts to happen you will get the First chance to match that offer so I Can say so don't worry And so he had to trust me a lot of People don't trust and then fast forward A year later his reaction was when he Finally started saw the dramatic shift In inbound inquiries and how many times My name was coming up as in the Conversation the qualifications and how Did you find us oh I heard Daryl on this Show talking to Anna and uh the CEO came To me and said you're a rock star now I Thought he was being a moroner that he Was busting me because we have that
Relationship I'm like yeah I'm a rock Star he goes no no you are like because I don't know how you did it but he goes For negligible costs you know our our Pipeline has never been so full you know On our customer acquisition costs has Gone down dramatically consequently so I did it a necessity the rest of the World's Gonna we'll get there when They're forced to or when they see Others like me having similar success I think you're going to see the down Economy that we're about to get deep and Deep into driving a lot of this Behavior Personally because now they're going to Have to because their budgets are going To get cut their staff is going to get Cut I mean you have this amazing little Caption there on LinkedIn which says That your voted top three marketers on LinkedIn and but basically what you just Said already provides a very good Example of how precisely it helps not Just you and Agora Palace or whatever Other companies you've been representing Before but also the people who are Searching for you because after all like You said in the beginning what we do Social media for is to get this exposure To share the influence and of course to Grow brand awareness and probably if I Followed you I'm gonna follow you right Now by the way but if I followed you
Before and I was looking for Um no social media automation software I would definitely have Agora pulse on My Reddit thanks to your Huge online presence and influence that You're spreading well I appreciate that And you know that's nice of you to say That but you know you know why do I have You know any influence I have why do I Have it I'll tell you this it's not Because I go up there and say you know With every single post hey you should go Buy agorapults you know that's not what I'm out there doing what I'm out there Saying is who is my tribe all right so In this case because I work for Agorapults I have multiple tribes I have Social media managers then I have Um you know Marketing Executives who Control the budget then I also have rev Ops people who are the ones who often Say this is the tech stack choice so We're gonna Buy Agora ball so we're Gonna buy HootSuite or want to buy Social whatever it might be Um Those are the tribes with my company and Then I say who's the tribes with my own Personal brand well again to be Marketers but it'll also be sales Leaders because I have a sales Background as well so understanding my Tribe then I make sure the content I'm Posting is adding value to those
Stakeholders the challenge I have is That I have a big tribe in the sense of You know talking to a VP of sale is Going to be a very different piece of Content and conversation than talking to A social media manager so you know Warning it sometimes you just can't be All things to all people so you need to Kind of focus on where your tribe was so My last gig I was really into the sales World that was where I was ahead of Sales zero it's a sales app you know Sales Tech so I was all in on that one Since I've come to Gorda pulse I've had To give my sales tribe less love so I Can give my marketing tribe more love And it's a constant struggle but the Point I'm making in all of this is that All of the people that I appeal to that I Target they intentionally want to Connect with I'm trying to add value Right so hey social media managers are You frustrated that you can't get more Money doing best in social media you Know maybe you're or you're not showing The results in organic social or you Know you're not have enough money to do Paid social let me tell you how to you Know talk to your CMO to change that so Now I'm actually talking to two Different people the CMO is Eavesdropping because I've mentioned Their name but I'm actually connecting With this and the funny part is at the
Same time the VP of sales is over here Eavesdropping too because they want more Leads so they're listening to what I'm Posting and they're going back to their Own head of marketing saying you should Read this post because this might help Us and then the Rev Ops person is out There going dang you know if we can do This and this will drive more revenue And I can show that the stack is is you Know more efficient blah blah blah so You want to make content is my whole Point here that resonates with your Tribe and you want to make sure you Don't over expose yourself and try to be All things to all people because then You'll just get totally lost and you Will get lost in the noise that's an Elaborate scheme you have there so how Did you come up with the how did you Differentiate your tribe in the first Place so okay that's a good question uh It's a it's a really good question it's A process I'm still working on clearly Because tribes change so in other words Pre-covet there was a lot of people that Were really prolific and had a lot of Influence that are much more quiet now You know like two or three years later During covet people who weren't even on The radar became household names because They mastered how to work from home and They they went all in on social where They didn't before so all of a sudden
Those people had more influence So how do I master it well I think it's Always keeping the the best advice to Get to anybody is you should spend like Two to three times as much consuming Content if not more five times ten times As you are posting content and the Reason you're consuming the content is Because you're trying to do a couple Things trying to get a pulse on who are The people who are influencing people's Decisions influencing people's opinions Influencing people's behaviors uh and And then once you've identify those People you want to connect with them and You want to comment actively on all of Their their posts and engage in Conversations so you you do so much Listening so you identify them the Second part is you identify the issues That are topical so for example a year Or two ago it was really topical to Really do a lot of shaming of sales Development reps to do crappy email Blasts with zero personalization and Everybody was hammering them you don't See that happening now because there's Been a a rebound from the community Saying hey enough shaming we understand We'll fix ourselves move on you're Affecting my mental health so if you're Paying attention you understand the Topics that are that are relevant The third thing is once you understand
The players and you understand what's Being talked about Again to my point you got to be actively Actively actively engaged in the Conversations more than the post Ironically the algorithms are somewhat Gained That your posts will reach You know as many people as you engage With so if you're not engaging with People but you're wondering why your Posts aren't getting more comments likes And shares it's because you're not you Know it's not it's not designed to be a Bullhorn a megaphone just for you it's Designed to be community so engage more With the community and obviously your Posts will get more likes and comments And shares because it'll be seen by more People a lot of people miss that Um the last thing is and this is I think This is a really valuable one that Locked it will miss there's a reason my Twitter handle is opinionated you have To have a take it doesn't mean you're Right it doesn't mean you're wrong but You have to have a take if your take is Yeah I agree with everything Anna said All day long you're adding no value to Everybody who's consuming your content Whereas if you say I love what Anna said Here she said a b and c and I told her I Agree with her do it it's been my Experience too but she also said d e and
F and I disagree with her And this is why this is my experience Here's my lessons Learners what do you Think is Anna writer am I right notice That last little bit a little bit of Click bait going on I want you to get Engaged but the whole point is I added Value I didn't just blindly agree with You I had a different point of view so Now the audience is going well I don't Know is Anna right or is generate they Both have valid points let's have this Discussion but I've added value to them Maybe at the end of the day they decide To follow Anna and do her def but that's Okay now they're informed because they Consider Daryl's version of Def and then They discounted it and they're better For it and they like that I challenged Them because they're now going to have Better results even though they didn't Do what I said So it's it's really about having to take And adding value and a lot of people Really really really struggle with that Point they really struggle the biggest Comment I get from people all the time Is I don't know how to add value I'm not That smart I'm intimidated by the Experts out there and when I hear that My response to them is and they Look at me like they're shocked and I'll Say are you like are you are you a sales
Rep you're on a sales call are you a Marketer are you talking to are you Trying to qualify prospects and they'll Always say yes great what's the Objection you get I get this objection All the time all the time how do you Respond to that objection I'll respond This way oh so you're telling me that You know the objection and you know the Answer and you can educate them and They're like yeah okay you're an expert Now go share that on social media and When I say to them that way they're like Dang I never thought of it that way I'm Like you have so much stuff to share Even if it's not what people choose You're part of the conversation you're Sparking debate and people will be Better off for it and they'll thank you For it because you have challenged them I said so people just need to have faith In themselves that's the biggest thing That's what stops people from being more Successful That's a long-winded rant I apologize Cool cool but yeah I totally agree with You I also because you've mentioned so Many interesting things so obviously you Have so many questions at this point but I wanted to go back to this Idea of like you know leadership not Understanding social media every time And I I can imagine that quite a large Group of our listeners are people who
Are running their own business and they Perhaps you know they have started with Their social media presence or maybe They're thinking about using social Media to drive Revenue now when you've Said that it's possible so If you could educate our listeners a bit Like okay what arguments you know are There so that you understand social Media better but you know as a business Owner as a leader as someone who is Responsible for the budget and then if You could also Include this idea of like marketing and Sales because very often you know it's Like okay should we do more marketing or More sales there are those in content For example it's it's a totally Different thing Like you have content marketing and it's A different breed and you have social Sales enablement right and this is also Like a different type of content so what About social media can you as a as a Person who is about to start Ah you know can you can you actually uh Do both marketing and sales is it Possible to align them or should you Decide let's do marketing first and then We're gonna switch to sales at some Point you know how do you do that okay So there's really kind of two questions There one if I'm here to write one is You know what do I prioritize sales over
Marketing where do I start the second I'm hearing you say it is is how do I Sell to you Daryl you know if you don't Necessarily think social media as a CMO Is a real strategy right how do I Convince you of my services to you know And get air time get you to actually Listen to take take my call so like did I get that right through social media so Let's start with Um the second part first how do you sell To me and then we'll go back to where Should you start Okay if you want to sell to me I'm going To tell you this is marketing 101 and I And I know 98 of your audience already Knows this However I'll say it anyway uh you need To know your ICP your ideal customer Profile a so my your ideal customer Profile right so in other words my Services I'm an independent consultant I'm an expert at what I do Um I Target I'm making this up uh High-tech companies that are SAS that Are based in North America that have Revenues between 1 and 10 million Dollars that's you know that's my I'm Making that up that's my sweet spot I'm Going to know everything else second Part is based on that I know the company That size there's going to be ahead of Marketing likely ahead of Ops of some Sort and a head of sales they'll
Definitely have those three roles uh the Marketing team is probably going to be Somewhat lean You know smaller team so they're gonna Probably have a Hands-On head of Marketer that's what I can assume okay Great so And I can I know at that company size Especially if they're SAS They've only got a Runway of so much Because subscription based means you're Losing money until you get sufficient Subscribers to make money so there's Going to be a rush to get subscribers And the second the second thing I know Is they're going to keep the churn down Low I'm what I'm telling you folks I'm Telling you everything related to the Persona the head of Market needs when I He's gonna have an urgency to get Customers in an urgency to keep churn Down low because if the churn is too Much they're going to go back to the Head of marketing and say get us more Leads to backfill all those who left us Okay that's the head of marketing's World that's where you start you come to Me and you you would hit and I remember Way back when I talked about most people Who are like a social media manager or a Content writer and I use those as Examples don't understand how to read Financials okay this is where you need To have a little bit of basic
Understanding because me and my role I'm Dealing with financials all the time I'm Dealing with the tlas the three-letter Acronyms I'm dealing with you know uh Customer acquisition cost CAC I'm Dealing with LTV long-term value I'm Going to lifetime value I'm dealing with Mrr the monthly recovery value I'm Dealing with ASP the average selling Price right these are Acronyms These are kpis key performance Indicators another TLA that I'm throwing In all the time to measure my success And to be held accountable by my Investors and be held accountable to the Board and be held accountable to my Executive team that's what I measure Against all the time I do not measure Against how many visitors came to my Website nobody cares all right nor does Anybody care about vanity metrics all Right likes comments and shares while Interesting Do not put food on the table at the end Of the day all right so I would approach Me by saying the economy is tough you're Likely being tasked with doing uh more With less so but knowing the typical SAS Play while they may be cutting back your Staff and cutting back your budget They're probably not cutting back your Targets If that's right
Would you be interested in knowing how You can dramatically increase an Untapped Channel social media To double triple quadruple the lead flow Going into the company and I can Guarantee it will be your lowest cost of Customer acquisition With minimal effort Right so if you say something like that And you're gonna have to refine it you Just spoke to all my pain points because I am dreading every single week when I Go to that management meeting and and I Have to talk about shitty numbers I hate That conversation the second thing you Need to understand and this is a really Really really really important lesson About to give every single person here Most people make the mistake of saying Okay well Daryl we have the ICP and we Have the Persona and we know that the Head of sales has to hit the sales Target and we know that the head of Marketing has to deliver so many mqls And so therefore my messaging is going To be are you stressed about hitting That number I can help you hit your Number are you stressed with hitting Your mqls that can help you hit your Mqls that's not what I'm stressed about I mean yeah it's annoying it's Frustrating but I knew I had that Problem when I took the job it's just Like breathing air that problem will
Always be there even if I hit my number They're gonna want more What you want to speak to when you're Selling me or any other senior leader is What's the pain they had yesterday What's the pain they had this morning That's top of mind so if I'm in sales I'd be saying to the sales guy are you Frustrated that your sales reps can't do A basic Discovery session like you know What this med pick or spice or band you Can't even ask the basic questions are You angry and frustrated what if I Showed you a way to Simply address that Very quickly That's the personal pain for me it'd be Like are you frustrated that your social Posts are getting zero engagement And you're getting asked if you know What you're doing by the leaders of your Company or by your investors Yeah I'm frustrated that I'm getting Zero engagement all right I can help you Fix that so the pain needs to be really Recent and personal when you're selling To me that's the first part Okay where do you start sales and Marketing yes is the answer Okay but I'll go into more detail if Here's what you need to understand the First thing that anybody who controls Budget does let's say you sent me that Killer Outreach that email that we just Talked about and I'm like who is this
Cat I am interested the first thing I'm Going to do is I'm gonna go to your Website I'm gonna go to your LinkedIn Profile it's first I'm going to do Because now I'm looking for credibility So if your website looks like crap You're gone if your LinkedIn profile Looks like crap you're gone why your Risk your risk to me so you have to Invest in marketing your company if Invest in marketing you now your LinkedIn profile could look great so What's the next thing I do I go look at Your posts because now I want to know is You know they look credible great Education they've been working for five Years or ten years I like the companies They've worked with I think they know my Space if your posts say nothing or all They are likes or shares and they're Adding zero value to me then I say okay This person does not understand me again I don't trust them I bounce So I'm validating you You have that killer email you got my Attention now I'm validating so the Marketing needs to be invested on Actually looking the game But nothing more than that you don't Need to spend a boatload of money this Is all relatively low dollars and since We're talking about So then the next comes in is is the Sales so the sales is huge so
Um And and that's we need to do Omni Channel you can't just use a phone you Just can't use email you just can't use Social you really need to use both all Three you could use texting in certain Countries you could use Direct Mail you Need to get my attention I'm telling you Now it's going to take me it's going to Take you hammering me nine times 10 12 Times 12 times so for if only start Laughing at your last you know Touch Where I go okay this person's earned the Right for a meeting they've been Relentless you're gonna have to do that You have to hit me on multiple channels Because you know chances are like I Don't pick up my phone but others do Right Um so you don't know so you gotta hit me And that's the problem is too many People when they talk about sales they Only stick to what they're comfortable With which nine times out of ten Is email and you don't want to see my Inbox you don't want to see guys like MiMi wake up in the morning it's it's Just horrific the emails we have and They're all bot based and they're all on Sequences the first thing we do is we Just go literally just do a bulk delete And the only thing I'm using to decide If I open that email is your subject Line so your subject line better be
Amazing and the second thing I do if I Open it because the subject line is then I look at do I want to invest 10 seconds Of my life reading this or not so if It's if I have to scroll more than once On my phone because that's where I start My day is on my phone You're gone so short sweet concise hook Me engage me speak to me multi-channel Outreach and then when I check you up For credibility make you look make sure You look good you just do that You're gonna be successful successful Successful you do not need to spend a Lot of money in in marketing other than Making sure you're credible Cool agree thank you disagree Oh yeah I agree I I feel that I agree Um still you know I wish it was like More popular uh but I I I really like The idea of having a solid website and a Solid LinkedIn profile like there is a Real person standing behind the website Yes because there was a time where Actually if you didn't have a website Then you weren't credible but now Website is not enough because everybody Might easily just create a nice looking Website but now I totally follow the Idea of having both like the website and And and the social media presence I Agree with that bit but let me just Quickly hop in here so I totally agree With that it's nice to be the person
Behind the brand but when you say it is Not expensive or you don't necessarily Need to invest a lot of money in order To Grow yourself and your business and Social media I kind of disagree here Because the time is money and as Old-fashioned and sticky as it is that's Really true so if you're going to spend X hours a day growing your LinkedIn Presence It costs it costs you it costs the Company you're not gonna do it after Hours probably because if so then the Company should pay you for extra hours Or shouldn't they I would say money is a Pretty big thing here as well Well the question you guys asked me is You said a lot of people have their own Businesses and they're you know where do They start right so you're right if I'm A bigger organization like let's say I'm 10 million it's a very different kettle Of fish than I've been buying you know Uh 300 000. all right and and it's a Lifestyle business and and maybe it Could be more if I just spend more time And more money Um so you're you're a thousand percent Correct But this is where people miss the mark It doesn't have to cause a lot of them The reason is he doesn't have to cost a Lot of money is it's very simple okay I
Can itemize it for you A website does not cost much I can pay 20 bucks a month in GoDaddy to host the Website I can spend 50 bucks one time You got a template I can actually hire Somebody at work for like you know 500 Bucks to do some customizations I can Write the content myself boom I've got a Reasonable reasonable Website as long as you know you thought About the buyer's journey and how they Consume content and you have call to Actions so it doesn't have to so let's Be crazy cost a couple thousand dollars Could build a uh an entry-level website That achieves its goal done social media That's just be that's just your time Your time is money but that's just your Time right that's just your time so you Can actually do a lot of the social Media if you're a solopreneur or you're A startup company you can do that in the Evening because nobody works an eight Hour a day I mean if if you're an Entrepreneur let's be candid about that And you can do a lot of that in the Evening but let's say you don't want to Fair enough let's go with that then it's About time blocking this is okay so I'm Gonna say a half an hour in the morning And a half an hour in the evening so We'll say from 8 to 8 30 I'm on LinkedIn And from four three to five or five to Five thirty I'm on LinkedIn boom done or
Wherever are the social platforms you Want to be on and I and and maybe from 7 30 to 8 I'm just reading the industry News And if I see an interesting article I Throw that into my social media Publishing tool the schedule to do a Share and a little commentary later on And then once a week I'm going to write A blog post I'm going to sem optimize it So they say it's four hours it's not Like it's over the course of six months That will accumulate I'll get you know 26 blog posts all SEO optimize if They're done right I'll start getting Some good inbound traffic Again that's time Um and then if you look at the you know Where's the bulk of your time set let's Say you spent four hours a day selling And that leaves you roughly what I've Just described three hours a day to do Follow-up activities on that sales cycle That's if I'm a solopreneur now that Assumes you've got one person doing the Selling which means he assumes you have Other people in the company doing the Actual implementation or the Consulting Whatever you've got but at that point The cost I have is for the actual cost Of the of the salary if you time block Correctly and you use enough automation We open up by saying what would you Automate use enough automation
Then you can make this very reasonable But all things are relative and I a Thousand percent agree with you and you Have to Value what do I value more from Me personally is it is it my goals and Aspirations for this company I'm Involved in or is it my life balance and If it's your life balance it's a Personal choice then you understand it's Going to take you longer to achieve your Goals and and no decision is right or Wrong it's a personal decision cool I Really like this perspective did you see What she did folks do you see what Anna Did she disagreed with me and she pushed Back And we had a wonderful conversation do That on social I love it That's what I was trying that was what I Was going for I got inspired by your Speech before And it should be see that's the thing Too many people take disagreements as Conflict it's not it's debate it's Philosophical discussions it's you know Let me understand all sides of the Argument and then I'll make a personal Decision it does not have to be conflict If you're making a conflict folks you Should be looking in the mirror that is My uh darylism for the day Hahaha Healthy The arguing for
Seeing that the truth comes from Disagreements basically that that's how You learn new yes I love it I love it Cool and now I have like moving on to Another part I guess we could speak a Little bit about how you could actually Turn social media into a revenue driving Channel you did mention a couple of Really good things already but how about Some more specifics here it turned Social media into our Revenue Channel There's there's different ways right so There's the marketing side where you're Growing your your base and your thought Leadership so that people naturally come To you uh that would be an inbound Exercise and they share your content so Shared content is inbound but you'll Hear the term dark social which means Dark meaning you can't attribute it you Can't measure you can't say where that Lead came from so if I make a great Piece of content and Anna shares and Then the friend she shared it with Shares it and somebody finally says yeah You know I got this from Susie and I'm Like who the hell is Susie but I didn't Know is Susie would talk to Billy talk To Sam talk to Anna and that's how it Came to be because that's what we do we Share great stuff that that's compelling So You gotta have great content that's the End of the day you got a Content that
Relates to the audience a little bit of Time and investment we talk about icps And personas uh great tools like uh Hrefs sem rush or any other SEO you know Optimization you can use to actually Make it relevant and and know you're Going to hit some some hot buttons are Will increase your impact and your Engagement dramatically so if you want To drive revenue from social there's the Marketing side and a lot of data on the Marketing side the other thing I would Look at is You really need to know the social Platforms that your audience your ICP Hangs out in for many it's LinkedIn but For others it's Instagram right as an Example and for others it you know Facebook is still relevant although it's Struggling so you got to kind of go Where your audience is all right Um if you're If you're tight on bandwidth Just pick the biggest platform and then As you have success and you have more Money to invest you can expand Um the other thing about how do you be Successful in Social is understand the Medium right so people are often Skimming their timelines right so I love Anna tat about the one social individual Was passionate about photography so they Had great great photos if that's what Your audience reacts to especially on
Platforms like Instagram Invests in great photography get buy you Know learn how to take a picture you Know if you have to create it you know If I look at I'm at my home studio here Right now right but I've got lights Because if I turn my lights off I'll do That right now you can see how much Darker I am right that's dramatic and I've turned my lights on all of a sudden See much brighter I am that simple Little change means that you'll see me In the timeline it sounds stupid I will Be more visible so it's my brand simple Little things a mic some mice and these Are things you can acquire over time and By the way I buy second hand and use all The time because I'm cheap as hell so You don't need to go and drop a boatload Of money the last thing is when I say Understand the medium if it's Twitter You know short tight concise you know Make your point if it's LinkedIn Um video is your friend I mean it's one Tool but it is your friend people watch Video and keep it short and tight right 30 seconds captioned captioned baby be Distinctive look good sound good You know if it's Instagram you know Photography again it's your friend you Know there's lots of different memes and Everything else really own it let your Personality come out so know the medium A lot of people are afraid of using
Memes people are afraid of doing video Okay I'm gonna give you some tough love Right now Get over yourself all right we all are Afraid we all screw up we all look like Idiots I'm a 55 year old man with white spiky Hair what am I trying to achieve here Okay all right but you can embrace it as Well you say hey because you know what When you scroll your timeline and you Say who's the old guy that looks like Santa Claus with white spiky hair oh That's sterile I'm like Daryl I'm gonna Stop why not because of what I said Because they're scrolling because of What they saw And then they did an association and Then he stopped All right so Just understand the medium so that's how You make money on that the other side is On sales Um Social selling Huge All right and you know where most people Below in a social selling why it doesn't Work for you is because you blatantly Create dummy accounts you try to follow Us we see we have one person in common And that you've been on the platform for Two months and you've got a rather Generic looking name
Um and uh and you really have minimal Content and your education is Spartan And we go yeah this is a bot we don't Follow you all right so Investing following the community so That when I see oh we have 10 people in Common we have 20. we have 50 people in Common like oh this is somebody in my Tribe so because remember I'm always Going to check you out even if you reach Out to me on social media you send me an Email you send me an unsolicited a DM I'm gonna go check out your profile and See who you are before I respond because Are you worth my time or not so Um the second part is when we follow do Not hit me up with a transactional Message 30 seconds later which will Model the automated Bots don't use Bots Trust me on this one don't use Bots we Can all spell it Um invest the time to personalize it Respect the individual be intentional Stop treating them like a transaction Stop talking about what you do stop Making it all about you you know if you Want my time attention let's talk about Me I know it sounds selfish but that's The way it works all right and if you Earn the right and the trust I will let you talk about you it just May take a month But in a month's time I'll give you like An hour as opposed to right now and you
Go for that quick close I'm gonna shut You down hard because I'm getting Spammed non-stop so there's you know When it comes to social selling just Understand there's no such thing as Shortcuts and yes it's going to take Time and yes you're going to say I'm out Of capacity and if you're out of Capacity that just means you need to Tighten up your target audience stop Trying to hit 5 000 people instead try To hit 50 and do it well and have Success and build on that so People are impatient on social it does Take time but I will tell you that Social selling is the number one channel Fulfilling top of funnel number one now Ironically once you make that connection It it disappears and then you're back on The phone and email and having live Conversations which is what you want Anyway because now you're truly building Rapport but uh that's it nothing rocket Science it's just put in the hard work Don't be a douche and uh and you know Understand who you're trying to sell to Don't be a douche maybe that's what the Name of this episode don't be a douche There you go not to be a douche better I Like that there we go I like it we've Nailed it now agree disagree what did I Miss I mean I like it how it sounds so much Because I like that sounds like a
Perfect closing statement for me I kind Of there are things that I want to talk About I know there's things Iraq wants To talk about I need to digest how well Of a closing statement that is Post-production you can always move it To the end so there you go you're all Set it's all good the power of editing Folks there we go I love it I wanted to touch upon two things sure What one is because when you said about Buying secondhand equipment I thought About our friend mihao who was on the Podcast and he's got a wonderful saying It's cheap so it must be good yeah so That's the first thing but then I wanted To ask you about the tribe and about Like you know the network because in Email marketing we have a We have something called list hygiene And basically it means that you want to You don't want to have 100 000 people on Your list Um you want to have people who are Likely to do business with you On your list so whether it's 10 15 20 Million Still you would like to send emails to People who are interested and then they Are obviously more likely to be like Engaging with your emails opening and so On you know so does the same rule apply To social media because uh when I Checked my LinkedIn account oh man I
Have a great network of people I I don't Know Mostly because there is a group of People you know that that I engage with And they interact with me and this is Cool but I would say that this is it's Not bigger than 50 people But when you look at the numbers I have Like around the network of 1000 people You know so what should we do with that Should we cater to this particular Audience and be very picky Uh should we go after a certain tribe You know what this What is your Let's say tip here like what to do with The tribe or people who don't belong to Our tribe but they we are connected to Them on linkediness so you know we're All people we're all like the eavesdrop Uh and and listening to other people's Phone calls so to speak Um I mean tell me you haven't been on a Train or a bus and listened to the guy Talking on their phone next to you of Course you have right you're like what's He talking about Um so what I why I bring that up is Because you should be talking to your Tribe but if you know you have a post Here and there that clearly he's not Targeting your tribe Um but it does resonate with some of These the other 50 people you talk about
That you talk to on a regular basis People get that you have a life you know People go to my Twitter they'll see me Talking about marketing and then they'll See me bitching about you know my Favorite hockey team well my hockey team Has nothing to do with marketing but I'm Still a hockey fan and they understand I'm a hockey fan and what it does is it Personalizes and humanizes me and I'm Like oh look at that Daryl likes hockey That's kind of cool I didn't know about That maybe next time I'll talk to him I'll ask him what his favorite team is Who knows right so people understand That but at the end of the day you Should be talking to your tribe uh Because that's more than anything Remember the whole conversation was What's the main goal of social media in Business so in business we said it's to Drive money and it's to drive money That's your target ICP and your target Person it's nice you should be talking To Um and if you want to really talk to Other people the other 50 people that Are perhaps more of a personal nature Very very different there's nothing to Stop you from creating a second social Media account your work account and your Life personal account and there you go Um so you can mix it up is really what I'm saying and then you have options the
Thing I want to come back to you made a Really great point you said I could have A thousand followers but I'm only Talking to 50. so this is what I get all The time is I get people saying I get no Engagement or I just talk to the same People over and over again I'm not Making progress and I'm saying name a uh Nene is a great is it John Pinette it Was great comic his line was always Nene Meaning no that's not true let me Explain And I remind people that 90 of the views of Your posts are from lurkers they're People who will never like never comment Never share never do bupkis they will Just consume because they're shy or They're wanting to stay hidden or they Don't want to spark conflict with a with A comment and get roasted by the trolls So they just consume The vast majority of the leads I get Coming in from my social media presence Are from the lurkers they're not from The people who are actively commenting On my stuff because they say it usually Go to this I've been following you for a While And I think you can help me based on What I've read from your content let me Explain my situation and can we talk About it so don't forget those other 950 People are still consuming your content
They just may not be actively engaging Okay cool thank you because you've also Like pointed out a very significant Difference between email marketing and Social that you have lurkers on social You don't have lurkers in email Marketing like an email they just Mark You as spam or unsubscribe or what have You yeah yeah get me off your list I Mean I do that I I don't spam If people Really annoy me I do but I read so many Emails that I either didn't plan to read Or didn't want to read but I end up Reading it for some mysterious reason I Don't click on anything once you open it It's already like you know in a Statistics so then you are actively like Engaging so you know you you but then Everything about email is statistics for Sure but but all you need to do is open The email but here you you just yeah Nobody knows that you've seen the post Even right it's like but you could argue There's open rates and there's click Through rates right so like newsletters Are a good example I I could argue I Learned on newsletters I get them they Annoy me on they're including my inbox But if there's I come from a brand or an Individual that I like I open it like For example I think on my case every Saturday I get an e a newsletter from Justin Welsh and I get a newsletter from Devin Reed both people who are also
Openers marketers who I respect I open it so I and I'm I am I'm an open Rate statistic I rarely click through But when I but I do because I am a Lurker will I ever comment or reply to The emails of course not it's a Newsletter it's a one-way push we're in Social you can that's the big difference That you can have engagement uh but you Know I have reached out to both Devin And Justin Privately because of a news that I have Done that you know newsletters do work Folks just want you to know that they May not work significantly but they work As long as your content's good or Overriding theme social email good Content stop pitching there you go [Music] And there you go now you know so much More about the fun ways to use social Media both for your brand and your Personal growth But you might be wondering at this point What the hell are we doing talking about Social media in the Sprint dedicated to Tools and let me stop you right there Because here's the thing not all of the Super fancy AI tool Solutions we'll be Talking and covering here are going to Be state of the art and something you've Never heard of before actually I hope For your sake that you have heard of Them before and what is a better way to
Kick-start the Year by making a Resolution and committing to better Social visibility of yourself and you Both personal and professional brands That's why our tools of this episode Are very simple It is LinkedIn and think of all the Magical things you can do with a proper Profile I'm Gonna Leave You to them because Nobody knows what you your tribe and Your company needs better than yourself But do marinate in it for a little bit And in the meantime you can listen to More episodes of operation automation Available on Apple podcast Google Podcast Spotify and wherever you get Your podcasts I hope you're enjoying our New Sprint if you have any ideas or you Would like to get in touch with me and Eric or simply you want to say thank you For doing this amazing marketing Automation podcast don't hesitate to Reach out at podcastresponse.com Or through Stitcher or Spotify or Whatever is the most convenient option For you looking forward to hearing from You and hear you in two weeks about the Next episode dedicated to a super cool Brand new technology you might have Heard of but I think you haven't Stay tuned [Music] Operation automation is backed up by get
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